I'm still a bit
unsure about which polyclay is best for sculpting relatively large and
thick solid figurines, kind of like statuettes or dolls. I guess I
have a few questions:

1. Modeling consistency: I've tried using plain old sculpey and it
gets very soft after a lot of kneading, such that you can't build thin
walls attached to thicker pieces, like you could with harder
plastalina, for example. Will super-sculpey be better for this? Do I
have to use an armature to do something like a 5-7 inch high person with
their arms and legs spread out (picture the famous DaVinci drawing or
something like that), or will the clay work with these thin
appendages? Another way to look at this question is how long and thin
of a solid tube of clay will support itself? It seemed like a 1/4"
tube of sculpey when warm wouldn't support more than a half inch
without bending.

2. Thickness of casting: Do the clays differ on how thick of pieces
you can cast with them? Will I have any luck trying to do an inch or
more thick pieces?

3. Multiple bakings: some of the web sites bake their clay numerous
times...the packages don't really mention this. How do you know how
many times and how long you can bake something, if you're patching or
building up layers? Can you always just apply some dilution material
and rebake parts of it?

Thanks for any advice,
Chris

I'm really new at this type of sculpting also, but have found that older
cernit works best for me. At three to four years old, it is at its best for
this type of sculpting. I have been making some pictures which have nude to
semi-nude ladies sculpted from cernit (very much in the Art Deco style). I
put them on a background of perod fabric and use butterflies, birds,
dragonflies, a moon, etc. sculpted from Sculpey. (This is somewhat of a
collage picture.) The nude forms are really beautiful against the fabrics.
I use small pieces of lace and even made a bird woman with feathers.
Originally I had started trying to sculpt just a woman in this same syle,
but had the same problem with the clay. Even with the armature the clay
just slipped around and even wanted to slide off of the armature. I am
gradually perfecting my armature and trying to work slowly. I don't know if
because I like to work regularly and at a steady pace, the clay becomes too
warm and then is unworkable. By letting it sit for a day, it works
better(or maybe I have more patience). But at this rate, it will take me a
month to do a sculpture of a woman. I know to a dollmaker, this does not
seem like a long time---but to me, I like to complete anything in a week. I
have a problem also with sculpting very small on an armature, so until I
figure it all out, I will be making lots of these collages. I can tell that
my techniques get better with each picture. I am in the process of trying
to get some pictures of what I've done, so I can get some constructive (or
destructive <grin>) criticism from all of you. (Our camera isn't the best
and with the glare from the glass on the frame I have to figure another way
to get pictures, but I'm working on it.)

Jeanne.

In my opinion, always use an armature. (See the other threads on figure
sculpting.)

You can rebake a lot of times -- we don't have definitive info on maximum
times or anything. Some say that after a while the clay gets brittle, but I
haven't run into this with my dragons which get to be about a foot long
sometimes. (Not that I have made a vast number of them, mind!)

In my opinion, plain Sculpey is worthless -- too soft and too brittle. Super
Sculpey is better, Sculpey III or Premo/CFC or Cernit or Fimo better still
(and not in that order).

You shouldn't have trouble with inch thick polymer clay, but if your work is
that thick you need to remember the INTERIOR needs to be at 265 degrees for
15-20 minutes minimum to cure, so if you don't bake in layers, be sure to bake
LONG enough. Also, if MY work starts to get thick (or would) I plan for it and
pad my armatures with crushed aluminum foil. Makes things lighter in weight,
and I can work with clay between a half inch and 3/4 inches thick overall,
mostly. I certainly would try not to get thicker than an inch, because it's a
waste of clay in my book... unless the piece were really huge, anyhow!

Sherry

Chris,

I sculpt 1/6 scale exclusively (12" tall figures). Forget old Sculpey.
Super Sculpey is good but Premo is better and is similar in consistency
(also less breakable after baking). You can build up thickness with tin
foil but be sure to perforate the clay into the foil (at a place where the
hole will be invisible) to prevent "boils"; this trick works and comes
from Sue Heaser.

I would make perhaps 2 bakings. The first at about 1/2 the final
thickness. I find that my figures do better with lower temeratures and
longer baking times but you can experiment there.

> Do I have to use an armature to do something like a 5-7 inch high person with
> their arms and legs spread out (picture the famous DaVinci drawing or
> something like that), or will the clay work with these thin
> appendages?

Without seeing the figure I would probably say yes...

Another way to look at this question is how long and thin

> of a solid tube of clay will support itself? It seemed like a 1/4"
> tube of sculpey when warm wouldn't support more than a half inch
> without bending.

Premo is tougher because it will bend before baking and you could try this
technique with Premo.

> 2. Thickness of casting: Do the clays differ on how thick of pieces
> you can cast with them? Will I have any luck trying to do an inch or
> more thick pieces?


I have done up to about 1-1/2" but you should use 2-3 firings.

> 3. Multiple bakings: some of the web sites bake their clay numerous
> times...the packages don't really mention this. How do you know how
> many times and how long you can bake something, if you're patching or
> building up layers? Can you always just apply some dilution material
> and rebake parts of it?


This depends on the thickness of the final piece and how you like to
work. If you are new to this I recommend making a "skinny" person over
the armature, baking it to establish a frame, and then go to a final;
that's 2 firings minimum. I have done as many as 6 firings on a piece.
Personally, I like to keep the number of firings down since you risk
cracking each time. I have done highly detailed, 12" tall figures in
*one* firing but not after doing other figures with multiple firings.
Experiment along the above guidelines but forget about regular (old)
Sculpey for miniatures; use Super Sculpey, Premo or one of the tougher
clays.

Good luck!
Arty

>> 3. Multiple bakings: some of the web sites bake their clay numerous
>> times...the packages don't really mention this. How do you know how
>> many times and how long you can bake something,

Are we all really sure that if a piece is baked many times and added to over
and over...that the new layers are really adhering to the previous ones????
Have they not already polymerized on the first bakings? What is holding the new
layer to the already baked layer???

I don't do this...so I am curious about this...I began to fear this practice
when I started to hear of ears dropping off after being added on . Anyone have
any thoughts????

Jodi

Well, I think any time you add raw clay to baked clay (including sculpturally
and for dolls) you have to use appropriate techniques. For my dragons, I do a
kind of muscle base first, then add a thin skin of caned scales -- the whole
surface (mostly) gets covered, it's not thick, and it's applied firmly so the
likelihood of anything "dropping off" is slim. On the other hand, I would
NEVER add on an appendage or any part with a small base and any
disproportional weight ratio to baked clay without pre-planning an armature or
else drilling into the baked clay and ADDING an armature. (This is how I added
wings. The wings were made separately with wire outline armatures and very
think translucent blend "skin" (think of bat wings) which to be appropriate
had to be unsupported on the bottom edge. So I made them separately with the
base of the wings having a wire projection sticking out. I could support the
wings in the oven OFF the dragon, and when cool, drill into the dragon's spine
and insert and glue the wire base, sometimes adding clay and rebaking for
extra support and detail.)

I haven't done enough heads to experience ears falling off, but it seems to me
if you are DOING it right (and we are talking normal human ears, not bunny
ears or something!) that the clay should be firmly enough pressed onto the
baked clay that it wouldn't happen. But brushing the area with diluant before
applying the ear might help or maybe putting down a thin film of something like
Mix-Quik and allowing the plasticizer to leach into the baked clay before
applying the ears might help. (Or simply baking the head base long enough to
firm it up but NOT fully polymerize before adding details might be the
answer.)

(That is meant to be a generic "you" by the way -- I know the Creager's dolls
and I wouldn't presume to tell them that THEY are doing something wrong! I
blush to imagine it!!)

Sherry

I think if you add raw clay to baked clay it's best to let the "marriage"
sit over-night or longer before baking again. This will give the
plasticiser in the raw clay a chance to join with the baked clay and a more
permanent bond is created.

OR, what I do is use Sculpey Diluent to speed along the bonding process.
Use a Q-tip to apply some to the area of baked clay you want to add to, let
this sit a few minutes, then apply the raw clay and bake. This creates a
bond better than glue! I've even tried to break things apart on purpose,
and it took quite and effort, if it broke at all.

Sam in MS

This will help though many are loathe to do it.

When I add fresh clay over baked clay I usually carve or drill well into
the baked clay. This enables me to get a better "bite" and avoid the
de-lamination that can occur, especially when applying fresh small
pieces on to baked surfaces.

Arty

Seems like someone mentioned a good idea for attaching (animal) ears, I think,
using a small piece of thick cloth or paper/cardstock as an armature. Put one
end into the head before baking, then add the ears--or any other small
projection--before or after baking. S/he said it made a strong connection.
Would probably be good to add a little Sobo before inserting too.

Diane B.

I agree with Arty. If I'm going to add some raw clay to a baked piece, all it
takes are a couple of swipes with 60 grit sand paper, and some firm pressure on
the raw clay. When the piece is rebaked, it's there for good!

-Deedee

I've never had a problem with multiple bakings. Ears, limbs, additional
clothing have never fallen off if the bond is enhanced through the use of
dilluent, or sometimes Liquid Sculpy, and the piece is baked thoroughly.
At this moment, a dragon with a twenty-two inch wing span is in the oven
for his fourth baking. He will go into the oven two more times before he
is finished. A complex sculpture is easier to construct and control if
pieces are baked, and their shape protected, and then the piece
assembled.

As to the question of armature, even the smallest of figures will benefit
from an interior support, especially if multiple limbs or appendages are
involved in the construction. On occasion, I treat the armature wires
and rods with Sobo Glue to facilitate adhesion. I also use Sobo on thin
armatures such as acetate and paper. Sobo works well if it has just
dried, but letting it sit for a half day or more results in a poor bond
and the ever dreaded bubbles. Better to recoat than risk that.

Favorite clays for sculpting large and small figures are two: Super
Sculpy and Premo. I leach both products for extra firmness because I
have a heavy hand and push clay out of shape more easily than I push it
into shape.

Katherine Dewey

Nope, sorry, none online, none likely to be. (I have only done a few, and I
don't have decent camera equipment so they were gone before I got the chance to
have shots taken -- mostly made as gifts.)

(They aren't all that interesting, kids -- just my main experience with
armatures etc. Go look at Katherine Dewey's stuff, she's one of my idols!)

Sherry

Another possibility is the Liquid Sculpey....it is very thick and strong
when baked.

Patti